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Behind the Magic: Bill Kreutzmann & Mickey Hart Talk To Billy Martin

You two have the perfect chemistry; different personalities is what it’s all about. A lot of young people think they need to emulate each other, but really it’s important to complement each other.

Be larger than life. That’s where the magic is. We’ve been playing for over 40 years and nothing feels quite like playing with Bill. He’s an amazing drummer. He’s the center of The Dead, the anchor. I move around in my way. Bill and I had to adapt a whole symbiotic thing. The visionary bass things that Phil was coming up with at first were unnerving, but in a way he really made us what we are with his bass styling. And we really liked each other from the start. We lived together as brothers with drums in the early years, and that was that idea of bonding and the idea of making this telepathic and taking it out of language. The language that Bill and I share is not spoken—it’s body language, winks and movement. It’s telepathic… It’s a secret language that we cannot describe.

It’s a unique relationship that I’m sure took work.

More drummers should play together but you have to have willing participants. You have to consider the band. We’re on the front line all the time, jamming. We drop the one just to see how they’ll jump. We’ll throw out something and it’s like, “Oh my god, what is Bob [Weir] going to do?” And you watch him and you listen to him. Then you’re like, “What is Phil going to do?” You look over at him and he’ll either wink or nod or do absolutely nothing at all. He knows what’s going on and the game is, “Is anyone going to care? Is everyone going to just let it go?” So Bill will get half of the guys to go his way and the other half will just pick me off and I’m on another pulse, I’m on a three and he’s on a four and we’re revolving. It’s like being on a magic carpet… The idea is when anything comes back there has to be some initial statement of musical intent that has to be reinstated by another musician. Then we’re really getting back to Earth— back to what we call music, organized sound, as opposed to jamming and freeform. All of these nuances that really are the basis.

Sure, there’s technique but I don’t want to talk about technique—everyone should have technique or they shouldn’t be playing. Technique isn’t the primary ingredient that you need in order to play with another drummer in conversation as opposed to just beating out parts. There is a difference between having a dialogue than Bill playing all the straight parts and I play all the cowbells—no, it’s way deeper. You have to give and take. There is so much nuance in doing what we think is right and that’s something that is very elusive because what’s right one night might not be the next. Me and Bill have decided, not in the spoken language, but we both know what’s really good.

We have certain sensibilities that make for a perfect union, I wouldn’t call it a marriage. I never married Bill. Sure being in the Grateful Dead is like being married, but we’re partners, we’re linked forever. Nothing will ever come between us. We’re the only ones who do that thing. So when I go off and play with Zakir [Hussain] or Giovanni Hidalgo—these are the greatest drummers in the world but I get a different feeling. It’s wonderful and glorious and I love playing in Global Drum Project. By the way, it’s been nominated for a Grammy in the world music category. We won the first Grammy in that category in ‘91. But it’s still so much different with Bill. Sometimes I just sit back and listen to him because it’s breathtaking. It’s beyond words. When he’s playing he’s playing.

That’s so poetic. I gotta see you guys this spring—it sounds beautiful.

Damn, it’s beautiful! It’s a rhythmic miracle. I play with other drummers—the best—and it’s wonderful, but it’s different. They are as good as musicians can ever be, but I am not complete. Now I’m complete because I have my love: my rhythm machine. Things are really great. This is a really wonderful year. As you know we’re going out next year and we’re going to have at it. We’re in a really great place in our heads and happy in our lives. This is also rhythmic entrainment. Just being good onstage that isn’t enough. We wanna go some place marvelous and miraculous the only way you can do it is by bringing all the good vibes you can muster and that good feeling, it’s the bottom line. You can’t play good rhythm unless you are filled with love. No way. You wanna play good rhythm you gotta have love. All the stuff that hippies say and all the stuff the Dead is all about. I mean I’m getting old, I’m 65 but I think I’m 40 or something. You gotta really train and get in shape for touring. We play for four hours a night. I wanna play like I’m 40 so when I hit the stage I’ll be smiling. I feel good! I feel good! Wooohooo! And it’s early in the morning.

You sound in really good spirits.

Man, I’m in great spirits. Drumming, all daydreaming about drums. You know about that. It doesn’t always happen. You have problems in life; you’re daughter wants to go to another school or something, whatever, financial problems, the Earth is dying. Whatever. If you don’t got it how you gonna give it? If you don’t got the good feeling how you gonna share it? It’s about getting all these guys’ hearts beating at once and taking the energy they raise and going out into the world and doing good with it that is the ultimate payoff. I’m not interested in the good performance, it’s gotta be emotional. Otherwise I have failed. I know when Bill gets up on the stage and he’s got that look in his eyes that it’s within reach—It’s really important to bring to the music everything you want it to give other people. If you don’t it’s not powerful spiritual material. We’re specialists in that. We try to go to those spiritual zones. We spent our whole lives trying to go there as opposed to repeating ourselves endlessly. We tried but we couldn’t do it. It’s a different payload. You miss this and miss that, but if the spirit is there it becomes powerful spiritual material. Our ritual is powerful. It’s about being real, it’s not about playing “St. Stephen.” Anyone can play “Truckin’.” It’s not about that. It represents something else. It represents a whole other plain of thought and emotion. When I approach the stage that’s the payoff, and I do this for fun. Don’t get me wrong this is not some spiritual Jihad, but I have been accused of world domination. I’m done!